Metal boat design forum vienna,sea doo jet boats for sale ohio,party boat rentals lake grapevine texas - Good Point

Published 23.07.2014 | Author : admin | Category : Wood Boat Plans

My article-text is finished but only what I need are pictures of these boats which I mentioned in the text. Minimal resolution of pictures must be 1000 x 800 pixels, and pictures of the boat in not-finished manufacturing process are also welcome. Now what is realy the important issue building from sheets, --- when you stand there with a huge panel swinging in the air, the most important thing is the framework, the framework that must be the exact form of the boat from that the panels are unfolded.
What's best then, ribs and frames you bendes somwhat into shape , ribs you troubled from the scaled planes not compleatly sure they fit with the panels --- what is best to fiddle or to know that both the panels and the framework work that both are generated from the same 3D model. Over the course of 23 years, Chris-Craft's Roamer Boat Division built nearly 2000 boats out of steel (1500) and aluminum (461) in sizes ranging from 27' to 74'. When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Question on setting up to Weld Aluminum » Thread Tools Show Printable Version Email this Page Display Modes Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode Search this Thread Advanced Search Similar Threads Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post What year model is this Lone Star Holiday? After being boatless for six years, a month ago I purchased a five-year-old 36' Brewer cutter built in steel. My wife and I purchased the boat with an eye to messing around between Alaska and Puget Sound during our retirement, which is a long time away.
Some have recommended that I bypass local yards and get a European yard with much more aluminum experience to build it.
For relatively small and not so expensive boats, one option is the small French semi-custom boats, made by small yards. Location: Vancouver Island Vega, your name is now a dirty word around our house. This one has an AVS of 140?, a twin keel that will permit you to dry out the boat almost anywhere for maintenance, and it is a fast boat for its type. I have also a PDF from a recent test published on a French sailing magazine and a video, but my internet link has some problem and is running too slow.
Even if I like it less than the 40.1,( it is from another designer) It looks to be a strong boat, and the owner of this shipyard makes from seaworthiness one of his banners. Given we are at a site frequented by designers, I wonder if overcoming sailors' prejudices is one of the most difficult tasks a designer has in getting a radical boat plan accepted.
There's a lot to like about the design, but I have to think that resale, always a possibility, would not be good in Canada.
In my opinion the relatively light centerboard boat can offer some advantages regarding seaworthiness; the real problem with light centerboard boats is that they have normally a lot of inverted stability. The truth is that there are around there a 1000 OVNIS and people who buy them are not the kind of guys that stay in the marina.
But you want a small boat, and small boats are more easily capsized than bigger boats, so special care should be taken in what regards the AVS and the inverted stability. Comparing this boat with the Vancouver 27 (I like it a lot), I would say that the Manatea would be a lot more difficult to capsize, but if capsized, your boat would right itself up a lot quicker. Location: Vancouver Island Vega, again great links, particularly the one to Noonsite, and Jimmy Cornell's take on centreboards and his Ovni -- which I don't think are bad looking boats at all To each his own.
Not really sure what you mean about lifting the keel in heavy weather, unless lying ahull or to a drogue or sea anchor. Don't know the difference between framing vs thick aluminum sheets, though it seems it would be easier to insulate with frame supports -- and that's something I think I'd want to do in my cooler home waters. I have not much time right now, so I can not chat about boats; but why don't you ask information about the Hermine 36 as well?
Don't forget to ask the guys of Coqalu information about the stability of both boats (RM curve, STIX number and AVS). I had considered building her in epoxy-ply, as I am a graduate of the old Bath Apprentice Shop in Bath Me, and have built several wood boats, so I'm comfortable in the material. I doubt that a 20-something foot boat made of 0.187" steel would need to be made of Corten steel! Make sure you go to the Glen-L site and read about the 'shrink-wrapped' welded steel tug boats they have there and see if those concepts can be employed in your boat.
Just my opinion, and I may not have understood the designer's reasoning for calling out that alloy. Location: ft myers, fl Thank you for your advice, I'll go to the Glen-L site and look at this technique.
It sounds to me that with careful construction and the fact that I'm not going to use her commercially, would land me at mild steels door.
I'm not sure about Corten's actual cost but welding does require preheat and temp crayons to maintain the parent metal at certain temp to begin welding. I agree that with a bit of training and some welding practice; a simple metal hull of this shape shouldn't be out of reach for anyone who has the determination to try. Location: Tasmania,Australia The whole idea of doing this in steel is overdoing it in my opinion.
But hey - you might want the welding practice on the new $1,200 machine you will have to buy.
Originally Posted by rwatson The whole idea of doing this in steel is overdoing it in my opinion. The tug cannot be trailered because she has a 9'4" beam and I plan to keep her in the water. Now, just have a think about the type of steel and the type of welding gear, and you're away.
So, since you're an advocate of being open, i assume you do not mind practicing what you preach.. I think that the question by Lumpy is what's the higher certificate that can reach a welder.
To give an idea one of my welders was able to weld at a perfect 90 degrees 2 razor blades Gillette (the old very thin ones for mechanical razors) without hole nor distortion. I'm a bit surprised that nobody mentioned the oxy-acety torch, maybe apparently obsolete, but excellent for the reparations of aluminum on the field, when you're in the wind or too far from electricity. Location: Cancun Mexico Yes this guy was of an unbelievable ability, I kept during years the angle made with the welded razor blades. And for you, your professional career, known by those who have to know it, speaks by itself.
When my group attended we saw the head of the Fabrication and Welding Department of the local Tech. I work with welders who can tick all the boxes in AD Hoc's list, but there is more to it than that. We had to do some repairs to an aluminium workboat a couple of years ago, which was something that we had not done before. We decided that the modifications would best be handled by the builders and we asked them to order the materials and send them down along with a couple of their men.
My experience has been that it is always better to take the advice of the people who are best acquainted with what you want to do.
I just wanted Whooosh, who claims to know everything about aluminium welding as he has told me he has worked with aluminium since the 70s, to quantify his experince in more detail, other than look at my pictures, as he doesn't elaborate any futher than this.
A few weeks ago, we urgently required AWS D1.1 6GR structural welding tests (any thickness) to be completed by two welders in a contractors shop. What we did was, I got the welders to set up test-pieces and root, hot-pass and do a couple of fill runs in my presence. There are lots of other practical applications in our industry where pictures help us to re-look at something we are not sure of without leaving our desks.
From Woosh's pictures I can believe that he is very knowledgeable about Aluminium MIG welding. Originally Posted by murdomack I've been told by some of them that with a well set up Kempi they can weld silver paper, I'll believe it when I see it. Originally Posted by TeddyDiver Kemppi with two p's I stand corrected, your country can be proud of such a product. There is a know-how, born of the experience, that can't be replaced by any diploma or certification, in every domain.
Originally Posted by Ilan Voyager There is a know-how, born of the experience, that can't be replaced by any diploma or certification, in every domain.


I take it then that the type of welding you do is not required to satisfy any standard to demonstrate that the weld is sound.
However, if you want to see some pictures, just for fun, then why not look at these i took of some down-hand welding tests for my own research. 11,000 gallons of diesel pumped at a dollar more per gallon than they cud have in Anchorage.
May you have a wonderful Thanksgiving in your country and a blessed coming festive season with family and friends. I have always made a living in a metal shop, and have a problem with anyone who says it takes an hour to master a bend break. The design I was reviewing had a single break configuration with the same die, and a stop set so that I am able to fly through the bends, and yes it would not be time consuming.
Originally Posted by MarkSail1 There is something else that is bothering me, It seems some are saying this method of construction is a thing of the past, and others are saying it is new. Originally Posted by MarkSail1 By the way I didn't get the feeling anyone here was trying to sell me anything.
But the website contains lots of marketing hype which is probably not so obvious to the non professionals. Originally Posted by MarkSail1 The constant Dix plug is evident, but he doesn't have what I want, and is not in the business of designing what I want.
Grinding wheels are a dime a dozen, and weld shrinkage is not a factor when using standard gaps, and knowing what you are doing behind the stinger. Frosty Previous Member   So that I may form a picture in my head at what your doing would some one please post what thickness of steel and what size are the sheets that is being used here. If you read the site referred to you'll see some plans being sold for small classic day sailors which would have quite thin and easily rolled plate. But he offers to convert others chined designs to what he calls the bezier method which is just a marketing catchword for rounding the chine. From what little I have read on metal hull construction a decent radius chine hull can be achieved by welding sheet metal sides and bottom to longitudinal pipes for the chines. I have been working out an adaptation of the radius chine method for smaller plywood boats. A typical radius chine hull is built with longitudinal planking for the sides and bottom, which are connected with planking applied circumferentially around the bilge in relatively narrow strips. In my proposed method parallel slits are cut partway across the sheet width to form the teeth of a sort of giant comb. For an adequately fair hull the number of vertical planks or teeth is large, typically around 40, whereas for a typical rounded hull with longitudinal planks perhaps 11 would be used. I quickly applied a constant radius to this example (I just took your radius from from station 9 ) and the resulting lines are shown on the left below. Don't you think the constant radius is a very sensible option, would not look any noticeably different.
Again the question is why would you form numerous parts to a slightly different radius when you get a better result overall with less welding and a smoother surface from a constant radius?
Originally Posted by MikeJohns The industry tends toward sensible design and good practice and it produces good results.
Secondly, with proper round bilge method these panels would have curvature with soft turn at the bilge to keel joint. Finally, the bow area with the "bezier looks very awkward and with the constant radius the upper tangent of the radius get sharper (blue line in sketch) (and getting it right is the trick that set some designers apart from others) until it meets the lower tangent at the bow - station 0. There is a reason why this old method is not used commonly by the steel boat building industry and the opening quote from MikeJohns sums it up nicely. Mike can do a stress analysis of every joint or plate in your design if asked upon and can you? Originally Posted by Wynand N Mike can do a stress analysis of every joint or plate in your design if asked upon and can you? Location: Long Island NY All the talk of steel when I already stated early on I was to go with aluminum due to size of the boat and the weight to strength ratio. I recommend anyone that is local to New England, take the time to drive up to Mass, and meet with Denis.
He was nice enough to take the time out of his holiday weekend to show me one of his current builds, using his method, this hull is fuc?ing gorgeous, and very similar to what I was looking for.
I was very impressed with his previous builds, and that one of steel boats built many years ago has only gone up in value with each sale, as it has changed hands. The weld shrinkage comments are for ****, and if you spent five minutes on the phone with him, which I am certain he is willing to do, you will most assuredly feel like an ***. Location: Alliston, Ontario, Canada Bezier curves are merely adaptable shapes as you all know, which can be expressed in relatively simple equations to be solved and drawn by computers. When converting a hard chine hull shape to a rounded form, a 2D bezier curve can be created for each station that will pass through the existing chines. There's not a great deal of difference between ply, steel and ally as far as the math of the shape is concerned. With a relatively thick material such as plywood which exhibits high stiffness when the sheet thickness is sufficient to provide adequate strength, controlling the bend to get an exact circular arc is not as easy as it sounds.
You can build you own tug boat with Glen-L boat plans for the Bo-Jest about what his wife said to him when he was considering building his first boat. You can build your own Tug Boat using proven plans and full size patterns developed for first time builders.
Of course, I contacted boatbuilders and wait for their answers but I know that maybe best pictures in high resolution always have boatowners. So many of the French aluminum designs (even passage makers) that I am seeing have ice cream scoops out of the stern for swimming and boarding dinghies.
Even racing boats in the Vendee Globe (alone around the world without stopping) use electrical pilots. French sailing magazines have said very well of that boat (sailing performance) and the interiors are very good. The shipyard has sent me more agreeable numbers and the boat has a impressive list of the standard equipment, including big water and fuel tanks.
It could be that the windows are made from spaceage plastics and well sealed and are not the deckhouse's weak link. They are used mainly as voyager boats and as passagemakers and I have never heard of one being capsized.
About the negative stability and AVS I am not so sure (not to say that I think that it will not be a very good one). I've never rolled her, but I have been knocked (almost) flat -- it becomes more of a knockdown the more often I tell the story . It makes sense to me (not a scientific or mathematical calculation, but a gut feeling) that they would be stable, though whether they track truer or are more sea kindly, faster, slower, I have no idea. They are rare things in my neighbourhood, but not sure of the reason -- is the reason really that in order to do any gearbox work you have to pull the boat? Also have some concerns about the tiller -- in my opinion, wheels are an abomination, a total waste of space in boats under 18,000#, but the tiller does look a bit delicate and the cockpit seems a bit awkward.
They give a little bit more drag than a single one, but if well designed, as they are in the Hermine, regarding cruising, the difference is meaningless. While I've done a little metal fabricationg before and some Mig welding, I'm leaning towards build her in steel. If can ask you my find out a reason that doesn't apply to you, or you may be a contribution for that design element's justification in skill level, home building without forming equipment or welding ease. If you can understand this process then there is no reason to buy the more expensive - but admittedly stiffer material - just use wheel abraded and primered steel. He gives away the plans for free on his web site, and only asks for reproduction and postage. While i realize that the hull itself is only a small fraction of the overall build, from what I've read Corten is difficult for an amatuer to weld and about 3 times the cost of mild steel?
Low's health and understand that if someone gives their plans away that the support wouldn't be part of the package.
So there is no reason I can understand for this tug to be in Corten unless the framing and hull panels were extremely light and you've already said they were not.


I bet you plan to trailer it around, so doing it in ply and epoxy makes a lot more sense to me.
The basics, the foundations that allow the person to learn and progress and to approach problems with an objective and positive attitude. They asked if we could supply a MIG welder, so I asked them to name their preferred model and we would purchase it and after the job was done, keep it stored for any future work. The Welding Inspector was based Offshore and had a heavy workload and he needed to book a helicopter flight in to see the testing getting done as well, so it was important that he was confident that his time and the oil companies money was not wasted.
I then took my small Sony camera and took two shots of the root in each butt and sent them to the Inspector by email.
What his qualifications are, or the qualification of his staff, is a question for his clients and their insurers. Pics well made are interesting to appreciate the quality of the job in several domains as weldings (but not an absolute proof; for example weldings may look very nice, with beautiful riddles and to be of bad quality in the point of view of strength), metal work of joinery. Class certs, ie what they are currently coded for, today, not 40 years ago, is a minimal measure of what is their current skill and knowledge. From the distance that the picture was taken the weld looks fine, nothing 'appears' out of the ordinary. For example the so called Bezier chine example is just a variable radius chine of constant arc. Material waste is minimized, especially if the sheet is trimmed to the required shape before cutting the slits, as the large offcut may well fit elsewhere on the hull. However, length being much greater than hull circumference, it works out that the width of the planks is similar. And he certainly has a right to reply strongly to negative comments about the constant radius method to sell this supposed superior Bezier innovation. After making multiple trips across the Atlantic this 34 foot boat of his stood the test of time. Shafer out there that he does not want to divulge himself, but I will say this, the man is of means that clearly display he is not interested in the sales or profit; rather he wants to provide a method of construction that would allow the average skill set individual an optimal build.
It should also pass through the waterline too to preserve some of the hydrostatic characteristics of the original.
A curve such as a hyperbola is actually easier to create - provided the total bend angle is not too great.
Hello, Somehow I just delete this post by accident so here is condensed version repost, again. Tugboat Plans Fishing Boat Plans Military Ship Plans Here are Strongbow model steam tug plans for you.
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Your recommendations are sound, but I've just got it in my head that once before I die I am going to do it the way I want. The price is 245 000 euros and include all taxes (you would have to take from that price the VAT that you will not pay, if the boat is for export - 19%?), but without electronics. Perhaps my prejudices are without good reason or perhaps they were concerns that once had merit, but no longer do. It also could be that the centreboard is superstrong and able to handle anything the sea hands out. I have a Jordan series drogue (which I admit I've never used), but would I lift my centreboard if lying to a drogue. And it also is a nagging worry, though I'm sure not true, that twin keels would work against each other when capsized and keep you that way!
Maybe that's why the Generic has a twin keel, so you can do some gearbox work on the beach!
Here a few images and a builders model of the hull which should give you a good idea of the project.
He can no longer respond to the endless questions on construction and I feel strongly that unless one has paid the full monty for the design that you are on your own from there, so I have not bothered Mal with the few questions that I have, and I respect his wishes not to be asked. That is like asking what is the maximum training for a naval architect, any other professional, or otherwise, could hope for, there isn't a maximum. Even within the same industries welders gain only experience of the materials and procedures that are used in the places that they work.
He is one of these guys that has every qualification in every metal that has ever been invented. They have been back a few times since for various repairs and mods and it's always the MIG that gets used. Based on the pictures he arranged his flights and I made sure the welders were lined up to start from scratch again as soon as he arrived. They are sent back and fore around the world before any commitment is made to spend or alter any existing system. Unhappily it's practically impossible to catch on picture the seaworthiness, or economy, or sea-comfort of a boat by pics.
But, funny how the human eye cannot see through the weld to highlight the lack of fusion, but maybe your eyes are better than mine and a picture, is enough for you. For a true rounded hull I suspect Mike Johns is correct, if your working with metal take advantage of its ductile nature and roll it to minimize seams; I wish plywood would do that. Caveat: development is incomplete, but FWIIW here is a capsule description of what I have been calling the vertical chine method.
Since the area is the same, it is obvious that the total length of seams to be joined is similar. It is unlikely that a single chine radius can be found that will satisfy all of these contraints at all stations so a constant radius adaptation of an existing hard chine design is going to change something, apart from taking some notchiness out of the cross-curves. There is the option to create shapes that bend in 2 axes, but the skill levels required to get predictable results are high.
We've changed our minds about style and materials a few times, but I think we are beginning to cross some T's and narrow our wish list. But I have a lifetime of prejudices that warn me otherwise (and I admit they are not from experience, but from reading and listening to the opinions of others).
Of course really big windows are always a problem (but this is not the case), and many times more important than that is the way they are fixed to the boat.
And as I have nothing to sell, nor client to recruit I do not see the utility of an photo album, more I do not feel the need to prove something to anybody, nor get approbation.
His choice was a TIG unit, I immediately questioned this as I knew that this boat and its sister were to have additions added to the keel at a later date, they were damaging the marine hoses that they worked with, and a MIG would then be best. I'll add that a good boat, smooth and easy going while running fast is totally unspectacular: almost horizontal hull, no big wave at the bow, no big foam at the stern, no jumpy attitude on the waves. Something similar can be created in plywood - tortured ply method - which is repeatable but the first item is rather unpredictable. I certainly like the look more than my Monitor, but will have to study it a bit more to see if it's as reliable.
I have on more than one occasion highlighted errors in the engineers drawings based on what I see in the pictures. Maybe a trained eye will notice that the surroundings waves look pretty stepped with some white caps and that maybe the boat X is running in a state 4 sea without any spectacular spray or foam.
But my point was that you can show someone how to use a roller or a press brake on a Youtube video or even reading a guide for an hour.
There was a welding exhibition at The Kelvin Hall in Glasgow and our manager arranged for all the apprentices to visit in groups on different days.



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Comments to «Metal boat design forum vienna»

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