In Rethinking Female Sociopathy, Part One, I went through a comprehensive list of sociopathic traits based on psychologists Hervey Cleckley‘s and Robert Hare’s psychopathy checklists.
If the answers to these questions are no, then it really doesn’t matter if you have an accurate diagnosis because it’s highly unlikely that things will change no matter what you do. What I do know is that the behaviors, as described by both my clients and the men and women who participate on the Shrink4Men Website and Forum, seem incredibly abusive and sociopathic to me.
Yet, in our society, men receive the diagnosis of Antisocial Personality Disorder and end up prison far more than women do.
As a society, we have so devalued men and overvalued women, that we have a difficult time believing that some women are just as capable as some men of being toxic, unremorseful, exploitative, abusive, dangerous jerks. We tend to view female sociopaths as sick and deserving of help and male sociopaths as monsters who should be locked away.
Bottom line: Male sociopaths go to jail and female sociopaths go to counseling, where they are often enabled by well-meaning, but clueless therapists.
This means that if an individual is diagnosed with another personality disorder or mental illness, for example, Borderline Personality Disorder or Narcissistic Personality Disorder, that their sociopathic behaviors aren’t considered sociopathic.
Now, before the “hive” gets itself into a self-righteous tizzy because Dr T, the quack, is confusing Borderline, Narcissistic and Histrionic Personality Disorders with sociopathy, let me assure you, I am not. Interesting side note: The self-identified borderlines who contact me from time to time to let me know that they’ve recovered and then go on to act out classic borderline traits via their emails, never rush to defend individuals with narcissistic or histrionic or antisocial personality disorder and caution me not to “paint them all with the same brush,” which, by the way, I do not. I see the dramatic or Cluster B personality disorders, which include Narcissistic Personality Disorder, Histrionic Personality Disorder, Borderline Personality Disorder and Antisocial Personality Disorder, as distinct phenomenon.
A lack of empathy, exploiting others for your own gain, and the refusal to be held accountable for the harm you cause others are the cornerstones of sociopathy. And while you’re engaging in that fanciful argument, defending these individuals who often leave a wake of victims in their path, and explaining why sociopathic behavior isn’t really sociopathic if an individual has been diagnosed with a different personality disorder or illness, just stop for a minute. Stop and consider for just one minute how the real victims, you know, the husbands, boyfriends, children, exes, and the new partners of the exes who are on the receiving end of the abusive behaviors feel. By the way, if you weren’t able to think about someone else’s feelings and their pain for one full minute, without interjecting a “yes, but what about my pain,” I think I may have just proven at least one of my points.
Sociopaths, regardless of gender, are ultimately treatment resistant, no matter how prettily they cry or how pitiful they seem.
And yes, it would be great for individuals with sociopathic traits to get help and get better, but, at least for me, my priority is helping and protecting the victims of sociopaths. Well, one thing led to another and we ended up having sex, a decision I will rue until the day I die. Meanwhile, I’ve done research, and now I’m almost certain that she has BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder). Her behavior will most likely only become worse after the child is born and after marriage when she legally has you over a barrel. Yes, it’s heartbreaking that another child will be born to and raised by another damaged, unstable, abusive woman who is unfit to be a parent, but the reality is that this child is just a drop in the bucket of children born to crazy, unfit mothers. Your best hope is that she will find some poor sucker who she will persuade to adopt the child.
A lesson to all men reading this: Beware of Crazy if she wants to get together to “just talk” after breaking up. When I was in college, my cousin’s B to the P to the D ex-girlfriend did this to him.
Eric, if you’re reading this, please try to disentangle yourself from the FOG (fear, guilt, obligation). Then ask the women who frequent Shrink4Men what it’s like to be the wife of a man with a crazy ex who uses the step-kids as a weapon and constantly tries to wreak havoc in their marriage.
If you find the information I provide free of charge helpful and valuable here on Shrink4Men, please consider making a donation via PayPal to help me maintain the site. Tears won’t bankrupt you and land you in jail, but giving into the tears and tantrums and marrying Crazy just might.
I will peruse the links in this post tonight and continue to learn all I can, so I know what I’m dealing with.
Not long after that chance meeting, the ex showed up on my husband’s doorstep in Germany. The ex talked my husband into letting her live with him, paying her bills, and eventually getting married and raising her son with her first husband as his own. After almost ten years together, bankruptcy, joblessness, foreclosure, and many dramatic and embarrassing cluster B episodes, they divorced. The ex has since moved on to her third husband, who basically took over daddy duties (except for the financial part) after she divorced my husband. For whatever reason your sense of your own personal power evaporates when you’re subject to her emotional bullying.
And acknowledge to yourself that when you’re around her you lose yourself and the power to protect your own interests. Assume she is the biggest liar and deceiptful person you have ever heard of and act accordingly or you WILL pay a price for it.
He should also be very cautious about offering her any kind of aid until he decides what to do. All the courts would see is that he was caring for her and by extension the child and make him continue.

And in the interest of completeness, there is one more option that should have been mentioned under #3, and here I offer it without further comment: D) Leave the country and change your name. For every single item mentioned, I can think of a real life example that every one of my clients has suffered.
Is this because men are more prone to this personality disorder or because men are more likely to have fa-cocked brain chemistry or hard wiring? I think male and female sociopaths are sick monsters and prefer to stay as far away from them as humanly possible. The fields of law and psychology seem to view male sociopaths as dangerous individuals who need to be locked away for our protection.
A diagnosis of Antisocial Personality Disorder is ruled out if an individual’s sociopathic behavior is deemed to be a symptom of another disorder or illness. It is my opinion that female sociopaths are given different diagnoses, such as BPD or NPD, and are sent to counseling, often with the same rehabilitative failure as male sociopaths who are imprisoned. Nor have any of them, ever, not once, shown empathy or concern for the thousands of men and women who have posted their experiences on Shrink4Men of being abused by individuals with these disorders. However, I believe that, fundamentally, they are just different flavors of sociopathy and, in fact, there’s a great deal of overlap within these diagnoses. Professionals in the fields of psychology and law need to harden themselves to the tears and manipulations of female sociopaths who play victim just as we do in cases of male sociopathy. I’d like to believe that if we, as a society, were better able to manage our collective cognitive dissonance about female predators, that the children of women like Theresa Riggi, Casey Anthony, Fiona Donnison, and Kelli Lynn Murphy would still be alive.
After several months of strict No Contact, I finally gave into her pleading voicemail in a moment of weakness. Anyway, even though marriage is the traditional course of action, I can’t help but think it would be incredibly foolish in this case.
Silly question, I know, as the baby was most likely deliberately conceived to trap you and give herself a hostage. It will suck to co-parent with her, but it will suck exponentially more to be married to her and later divorce her. Furthermore, if she decides to play games with custody, unless she is overtly over-the-top crazy, she will most likely be able to snow custody evaluators and judges. Then we had a discussion about how so many otherwise smart men are so stupid when it comes to crazy, predatory women. As Mellaril, a Shrink4Men Forum mod recommended on your original post, you need to find out if she really is pregnant. Decide if you a) are going to marry her, b) not marry her, but exercise your parental rights (that is, if the child is yours) or c) sign away your parental rights and just pay the state requirement for child support. Do due diligence about the realities of  being married to a chaotic, chronically selfish and immature, abusive woman and the realities of trying to co-parent with the same.
You do not want to inflict this on the hopefully emotionally healthy, kind and loving woman you choose to marry in the future. Brace yourself to be portrayed as the bad guy for not marrying her and not wanting to be coerced into fatherhood. I’m sure there are many men and women here who will offer you the wisdom of their experiences. Protect yourselves and don’t make yourselves legally vulnerable to this kind of woman. I’ve seen the signed affidavit to the effect from the local nonprofit pregnancy center, as well as the positive test.
I’m just so thankful that I discovered how truly bad things are *now* rather than continuing to fumble around in the dark and optimistically assume that I was just dealing with pregnancy hormones.
And, in doing so, eventually, you may be providing the child with a safe haven to escape to , away from the BPD mom.
T is incredible – I think though the point is you MUST follow ALL this advice to stand any chance of getting through this sane. If he supports her now then he is setting up a precedent and it doesn’t even have to be his kid for him to be trapped. Having a full understanding of your rights, responsibilities and what you’re likely to face is information you need to have in order to make the best decision.
Most of the men and women I work with often arrive to my virtual office trying to figure out what the hell is going on in their relationships.
And they have a much easier time getting away with their predations because we, as a society, refuse to acknowledge and address the problem. Borderlines and Narcissists act in sociopathic ways because they fear abandonment, rejection and feeling and appearing inferior and not because they’re sociopaths,” be my guest.
And that the countless men, women and children who have had their lives ruined by these predators would not have had to suffer so needlessly nor be run through the wood chipper of family court, children’s services and parental alienation. Her      practice    combines practical advice, support, reality testing and      goal-oriented    outcomes. She is pressing me to marry her ASAP “for the baby’s sake.”  Even though this is  the “traditional” option and would save my reputation a bit.
If I were in your shoes, I would be very clear that you have no intention of marrying her and that you do not want to co-parent with her. Instead, he got a beautiful son, but many years of legal hassles, expense, threats and heartache — and not just for him, but for his parents, siblings and extended family.

Trapping you into fatherhood against your will is a form of abuse called reproductive coercion.
This may be your kid or it may be some other man’s offspring she harvested to trap and trick you. Whatever you ultimately decide, you should speak with an attorney who specializes in this area. Most of them will tell you marrying this kind of woman is one of the biggest mistakes they ever made. If this woman is carrying your child, you will need to become a boundary setter extraordinaire.
Unless they have also been in a relationship with someone like your ex, they have no business judging you. Her practice combines practical advice, support, reality testing and goal-oriented outcomes. In fact, my priest recommended that as well -he also assured me that, under the circumstances, I have no obligation whatsoever to marry the girl.
You posted “she flipped out and guilt-tripped me into agreeing that we really ought to marry, and soon. Do not buy baby crap, do not join her for birthing classes, do not pretend to be a happily married father. A lot of the men and women here wish they had had someone intervene at their past critical moment. Giving her ongoing access to you and your life just gives her more opportunities to keep FOGging you. I don’t know how the state works where he is but I can see that happening easily where I am.
All our friends are conservative Catholics who will no doubt consider me the scum of the earth if they know I not only had premarital sex, but refuse to marry the girl when she’s pregnant.
In the wrong hands (or womb), it can be the seeds of a life of misery, pain and psychological, physical and financial ruin. Women who are willing to trap a man into fatherhood will have no problem lying about being pregnant. If she is pregnant, if the child is yours, and if you decide to take an active role, you will also need to research parallel parenting vs.
If your ex really does exhibit the kinds of behaviors and traits described throughout the many Shrink4Men publications, you will be in a no-win situation no matter what you do. Let your friends know exactly how she treated you and that you strongly suspect she is trying to trap you. He advised me to do nothing until the baby was born -no big decisions to get married, or leave her.
Marrying because some harpie wouldn’t let you alone until you agreed AFTER she trapped you into a pregnancy?
For a 24 year-old guy you’re going to have to grow up fast and really focus on becoming a master of controlling all aspects of your behaviour around this woman. Ask them how effective they have been in shielding their children from their mothers’ craziness and abuse. Marriage as a construct and a contract is less important than the flesh and blood human beings participating in that construct and contract.
Even if you do, that will not stop her from engaging in parental alienation and playing games with access. I just wish the courts would stop rewarding these predators with 18 – 21 year cash payouts. If she is pregnant with your kid, you are going to need to learn how to best protect yourself, so that if the law allows you to do so, maybe you can also protect the child. By the way, marrying this woman does not guarantee she will not alienate the child from you.
Of course, when I told her that my priest didn’t want to marry us ASAP, she flipped out and guilt-tripped me into agreeing that we really ought to marry, and soon.
He ended up supporting her until he found the cajones to get out and away from her entrapment. Woman claims mental condition is secret of her successStudy Law Courses Online Australia10.4 Self-defence5 Sex discriminationANTI-TERRORISM ACT (NO. In my opinion, you would be incredibly foolish to enter into a legally binding contract with her and the State, which is VERY woman-biased. She then got on the phone and called around until she found a priest who said he would marry us. I have no doubt that those sorts of treatments can be useful for some things, but in her case, she definitely needs more. But he’s braced up for it, braced up for his reputation and her smear campaigns, but will NOT take the psycho back.

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Category: Back With Ex

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